SENATOR THE HON ANNE RUSTON

SHADOW MINISTER FOR HEALTH AND AGED CARE

SHADOW MINISTER FOR SPORT

MANAGER OF OPPOSITION BUSINESS IN THE SENATE

TRANSCRIPT

INTERVIEW WITH ANDREW CLENNELL, SKY NEWS

3 July 2023

Subjects: National Anti-Corruption Commission, the Voice, Labor’s approach to 60 day dispensing, COVID Royal Commission, 24/7 nurses in aged care homes, Cameron Caldwell and the Fadden by-election, Katy Gallagher

E&OE……………………………………

ANDREW CLENNELL: The Shadow Federal Health and Aged Care Minister, Anne Ruston, from Adelaide. Anne Ruston, thank you for your time.

SENATOR RUSTON: Thanks for having me.

CLENNELL: So, we've got to start to the National Anti-Corruption Commission. Can I start with the reaction to that - start of the NACC?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, I mean, obviously it's something that is a really important institution - to make sure that Australians maintain confidence in the integrity of our institutions. So obviously, we welcome it starting today.

CLENNELL: Do you see many politicians ultimately being subject to findings here?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, I mean, obviously that's a matter for the independence of the body. And that's the most important thing, is that we need to recognise and respect the independence. But it's clearly an authority that's got a fair bit of power and along with that power goes a fair bit of responsibility. So, I think it's an important institution, but it has to be respected for its independence and I'm not going to pass any judgement.

CLENNELL: Do you think Stuart Robert has issues of concern with the Commission?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, look, if anybody has got any issues at all in relation to any matters or any people, then it's up to those people to refer those matters to the Commission. And the Commission, obviously, through its threshold and its independence, will make a determination as to what they do with the information that they receive. You know, it's not for me to be making comments on individuals.

CLENNELL: Do you have any fears about the new body?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, as I said, I think it's a very powerful body and with that power goes a huge amount of responsibility. And I think the most important thing is that its independence is respected and its independence is maintained. Because, obviously, nobody accepts corrupt behaviour and we need to make sure that where there is corrupt behaviour, there's a mechanism appropriately to call that out. But that mechanism must be independent, and I'd like to think that the new National Anti-Corruption Commission will be that body.

CLENNELL: I wanted to ask you about the launch of the Yes23 campaign yesterday. What do you think of the Voice and of the campaign that's being run for it?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, I mean, I think I've been fairly clear in my concerns about the lack of information that's been provided to Australians around what the constitutionally enshrined Voice is likely to mean for Australians. We can't get people who are experts in the Constitution, we can't get the legal fraternity, we can't even get Indigenous Australians to agree on what this actually is and what it's going to look like going forward. So, you know, it's concerning. But what I'd say is that every single Australian, individually, one by one, will walk into that ballot box and cast their vote. Don't be influenced by the pressure that's put on you by others, go and find out for yourself the information that you need to know about both the yes and the no cases, and then go and make your own informed decision. Because I would suggest that corporate Australia and also some of the big sporting bodies - I'm sure they haven't asked their shareholders or their players as to what their views are. This is corporate Australia and big sport in Australia, in the capital cities, making a statement. But I'd say to every Australian, make your own mind up.

CLENNELL: And just on that, your Leader had some choice comments yesterday about corporates donating to the Voice. He's saying they're almost being shamed into it or being gutless. Do you back that in?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, I certainly think that there is an informed choice to be made here, and corporate Australia just going out and picking one side without clearly understanding the details - because, I mean, no Australian understands the details of this Voice because they simply aren't there, despite having been asked to the Government a million times to provide more detail. So corporate Australia going out and throwing money at one side of an argument when there's no information is - I probably would say, as I said before, Australians should actually be going and informing themselves and not being told what to do by people who live in big cities.

CLENNELL: Just in your portfolio of Health, Pharmacists have started a campaign against the Government's 60-day dispensing rules. Do you think they have any hopes of overturning the Government's position on this or coming to a negotiation?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, I'd be saying to the Albanese Labor Government and to Mark Butler as the Minister, get back to the table. I mean, nobody, nobody could deny that getting Australians more affordable and easier access to medicines is a good thing. But what this Government has done is without consultation, without any modelling, without considering the secondary consequences, have actually forced the cost of this measure - this cost-of-living relief measure that they're claiming so much credit for - they're actually making your community pharmacy pay for it. And so, right now, I'd be saying to the Government, get back to the table. Negotiate in good faith. You've got the Community Pharmacy Agreement that's in place that you really have trashed by this action. Get back to the table so we can make sure we have the best of both worlds - Australians getting access to cheaper medicine, but also community pharmacy not being compromised, their viability being compromised, by an action of the Government that they haven't even bothered to consult on.

CLENNELL: The PM keeps seeming to duck to what he promised in terms of a COVID inquiry or Royal Commission. Do you support such an inquiry, and is it time for one?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, I mean, obviously, there's been a lot of investigation into COVID. But, you know, it's once again, a case of - the Prime Minister went to the election with a whole heap of promises that he made to Australians, and I think Australians have got every right to be expecting this Government and this Prime Minister to actually deliver on their promises, whether it be this particular one or a myriad of other promises that he seems to have completely forgotten about now.

CLENNELL: Well, speaking of which – Aged Care – you are making a thing of that, I suppose. The deadline for the Government's promise for all aged care homes to have a nurse on 24/7 was on last Saturday. That's obviously not been met. Do you see the promise as some sort of con. Do you think the Government will, in say a year's time, deliver on it?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, obviously, right now the biggest challenge facing our care sector across the board is access to workforce. And, it doesn't matter how much this Government wants to legislate, you know, simply the workforce just isn't there. We know that we are some 8,000 nurses short right now, just to deliver on the commitments that are before us today. So, obviously we want the best possible care and we'd love to see 24/7 nurses in all of our aged care facilities, but you simply can't deliver that if you don't have the workforce. And what we'd be saying is, stop with putting so much stress and pressure and anxiety onto our aged care sector. Let them actually do the best possible job they can to look after our older Australians and let's work with the sector to try and see if we can work through resolving the challenges that are before us, so we can get on with delivering the care that I think every Australian wants for older Australians when they are in a position where they have to go into residential care.

CLENNELL: And we have the Fadden by-election on in a couple of weeks. What's an acceptable result for the Liberal Party in this by-election?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, obviously, you never take any election for granted. And certainly by-elections can be tricky at the best of times. But I think we've preselected a great candidate, he's a local member of the community, he's out on the ground working really hard. And we'd hope that Australians would be noticing by now that for all the promises of the Albanese Labor Government when they went to the election last year, I don't think there'd be an Australian who could stand here today and say that they thought that they were better off than they were 12 months ago. And so, we hope that the people of Fadden will see that, because we've got a great candidate and I think it's a real opportunity for them to send a message to the Albanese Labor Government that for all their promises, life is not better under Mr. Albanese.

CLENNELL: What if there isn't a swing to you? That'll spell real trouble for the next federal election, wouldn't it, if that were to occur?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, as I said, you never take a by-election for granted. You never take any election for granted. There's always, you know, it's challenging. You're not going to change the Government by the result of this election. But as I said, we've got a great candidate. He's working really, really hard. He's a local member of his community and served on the local council. And I think, you know, he provides a really great and strong candidate for the people of Fadden to vote for. So obviously, we're hopeful that the people of Fadden will see what a great candidate we've got, but also the fact that this government has not delivered on the promise of making life better for Australians – in fact, every Australian's life is worse.

CLENNELL: Alright, Linda Reynolds is a friend of yours. So I wanted to ask about this pursuit of Katy Gallagher in the Senate. Where do you think this is up to? Will you keep going with it?

SENATOR RUSTON: Well, look, I mean, the most important thing about our political processes is that there are certain integrity provisions that exist that I think need to be upheld. And I mean, it's quite clear from just about everybody's interpretation that Katy Gallagher misled the Senate with her comments in relation to what she knew and when she knew it. The fact that she continues to try and obfuscate and not actually - I mean, she could just walk back into the Senate and say that she did mislead and correct the record and get on with it. But she's refusing to do that. And I think, you know, it's a very serious accusation to say that you've misled the Senate and misled the Parliament. And it's disappointing that Katy Gallagher and the Labor Government are not actually acknowledging the importance of that issue.

CLENNELL: There seems genuine outrage from your side of the Senate on this matter, doesn't there? Why is that? Are your Senators unhappy with the way Brittany Higgins and David Shiraz handled this?

SENATOR RUSTON: What we're concerned about is the fact that it seems like the Labor Party have got one set of rules for themselves and another set of rules for us. Both Katy Gallagher and a number of her other colleagues pursued Linda Reynolds relentlessly about what she knew and when she knew it. And yet when the tide is turned and we are asking legitimate questions about what the Labor Party knew and how they behaved, they seem to think that somehow they're going to be judged by a different standard than the way they were judging us when we were in government. That's what we are outraged about.

CLENNELL: Anne Ruston, Shadow Health Minister and Aged Care Shadow Minister, thanks so much for your time this afternoon.

SENATOR RUSTON: Thanks, Andrew.

ENDS